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	<title>Comments on: For Love or Money: The Lessons of Modern Romance</title>
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	<link>http://www.overthinkingit.com/2010/03/17/for-love-or-money-the-lessons-of-modern-romance/</link>
	<description>Overthinking It subjects the popular culture to a level of scrutiny it probably doesn&#039;t deserve.</description>
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		<title>By: perich</title>
		<link>http://www.overthinkingit.com/2010/03/17/for-love-or-money-the-lessons-of-modern-romance/#comment-16962</link>
		<dc:creator>perich</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Apr 2010 11:41:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.overthinkingit.com/?p=13944#comment-16962</guid>
		<description>@marion: We have a strict policy against Fyvush Finkel references on this site.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@marion: We have a strict policy against Fyvush Finkel references on this site.</p>
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		<title>By: marion</title>
		<link>http://www.overthinkingit.com/2010/03/17/for-love-or-money-the-lessons-of-modern-romance/#comment-16954</link>
		<dc:creator>marion</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 06 Apr 2010 22:44:17 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I know this post is from weeks ago, now, but I just read it and I have one question: 

How can you write a post titled For Love or Money and not even once reference &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0106941/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;For Love or Money&lt;/a&gt;?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I know this post is from weeks ago, now, but I just read it and I have one question: </p>
<p>How can you write a post titled For Love or Money and not even once reference <a href="http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0106941/" rel="nofollow">For Love or Money</a>?</p>
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		<title>By: Jeff</title>
		<link>http://www.overthinkingit.com/2010/03/17/for-love-or-money-the-lessons-of-modern-romance/#comment-16332</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeff</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Mar 2010 17:43:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.overthinkingit.com/?p=13944#comment-16332</guid>
		<description>If we are focusing on the film as a parallel to real life, then I offer this...what&#039;s the point of the successful career/making lots of money if you have no one to share it with?  This is what I find as one of the main points in the either/or world of romcom, the message being that material wealth is inherently empty and even though you may be poor, you&#039;ll at least be poor together.  Family Man is a good example of this.  Debate if you will, and I do agree that in the real world money problems often trump love, but movies only have about 2 hours to tell their story, and to leave audiences feeling good about what they saw they often end with &quot;we found each other, and we&#039;ll just work out the easier part of paying rent later&quot;.

Now, I&#039;m equating &quot;career&quot; with &quot;money&quot; above.  However, if the job is more about personal fulfillment or making a difference in the world, then compromises should be made in real life, but again the movies usually have to end up on one side or the other.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If we are focusing on the film as a parallel to real life, then I offer this&#8230;what&#8217;s the point of the successful career/making lots of money if you have no one to share it with?  This is what I find as one of the main points in the either/or world of romcom, the message being that material wealth is inherently empty and even though you may be poor, you&#8217;ll at least be poor together.  Family Man is a good example of this.  Debate if you will, and I do agree that in the real world money problems often trump love, but movies only have about 2 hours to tell their story, and to leave audiences feeling good about what they saw they often end with &#8220;we found each other, and we&#8217;ll just work out the easier part of paying rent later&#8221;.</p>
<p>Now, I&#8217;m equating &#8220;career&#8221; with &#8220;money&#8221; above.  However, if the job is more about personal fulfillment or making a difference in the world, then compromises should be made in real life, but again the movies usually have to end up on one side or the other.</p>
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		<title>By: Internet&#8217;s most interesting &#124; Sam Downing</title>
		<link>http://www.overthinkingit.com/2010/03/17/for-love-or-money-the-lessons-of-modern-romance/#comment-16141</link>
		<dc:creator>Internet&#8217;s most interesting &#124; Sam Downing</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Mar 2010 21:07:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.overthinkingit.com/?p=13944#comment-16141</guid>
		<description>[...] For Love or Money: The Lessons of Modern Romance [Overthinking It] [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] For Love or Money: The Lessons of Modern Romance [Overthinking It] [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Tim Peever</title>
		<link>http://www.overthinkingit.com/2010/03/17/for-love-or-money-the-lessons-of-modern-romance/#comment-16094</link>
		<dc:creator>Tim Peever</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Mar 2010 09:11:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.overthinkingit.com/?p=13944#comment-16094</guid>
		<description>Just chiming in with a &quot;well, actually...&quot; here: what we have of Aristotle&#039;s &quot;Poetics&quot; does indeed focus on tragedy, but we&#039;re pretty sure that there is a lost part of it that talked about comedy. (I think it says right in the text that he&#039;s going to talk about both of them.) A great many of his works have been lost to time, for pretty much the usual reasons.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just chiming in with a &#8220;well, actually&#8230;&#8221; here: what we have of Aristotle&#8217;s &#8220;Poetics&#8221; does indeed focus on tragedy, but we&#8217;re pretty sure that there is a lost part of it that talked about comedy. (I think it says right in the text that he&#8217;s going to talk about both of them.) A great many of his works have been lost to time, for pretty much the usual reasons.</p>
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		<title>By: Akilah</title>
		<link>http://www.overthinkingit.com/2010/03/17/for-love-or-money-the-lessons-of-modern-romance/#comment-16044</link>
		<dc:creator>Akilah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 Mar 2010 12:02:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.overthinkingit.com/?p=13944#comment-16044</guid>
		<description>You talk about catharsis, but I think there&#039;s also another element here:  fantasy.  Part of seeing Love vs. Career or any romantic movie is the element of fantasy.  It is specifically NOT like real life, which provides a lot of the draw.  So if we&#039;re talking about catharsis and escapism, seeing the exact opposite of real life play out or, rather, seeing the choice of true love before seeing the consequences of choosing true love (now where will I work?) provides the escapism and fantasy of Happily Ever After.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You talk about catharsis, but I think there&#8217;s also another element here:  fantasy.  Part of seeing Love vs. Career or any romantic movie is the element of fantasy.  It is specifically NOT like real life, which provides a lot of the draw.  So if we&#8217;re talking about catharsis and escapism, seeing the exact opposite of real life play out or, rather, seeing the choice of true love before seeing the consequences of choosing true love (now where will I work?) provides the escapism and fantasy of Happily Ever After.</p>
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		<title>By: Dan</title>
		<link>http://www.overthinkingit.com/2010/03/17/for-love-or-money-the-lessons-of-modern-romance/#comment-16031</link>
		<dc:creator>Dan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 Mar 2010 03:52:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.overthinkingit.com/?p=13944#comment-16031</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m going to present myself as a counterexample, the exception that proves the rule.

Just kidding about that last part... I put it in there to annoy Wrather.

Seriously, though, I had a career I quite liked when I met and fell in love with my wife.  I moved to be with her, and have not been able to find a stable job in the field since.  Do I regret my choice?  Not one little bit.

Now, our life hasn&#039;t quite played out like in the movies, but I&#039;ll likely end up a barrista or the equivalent next year, which will put my post graduate degrees to great use, I&#039;m sure.  I suppose I could move to another state where I&#039;m more likely to find work in my chosen field, but that would mean not being near my wife.

So in at least one case, life is actually sorta like the movie.  The difference being that in the movie, when the career person gives up their career as a lawyer or investment banker, they find a DIFFERENT fulfilling career as a teacher or a park ranger.  I gave UP a career as a teacher, and will probably end up with a McJob.  So I guess there is some difference there.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m going to present myself as a counterexample, the exception that proves the rule.</p>
<p>Just kidding about that last part&#8230; I put it in there to annoy Wrather.</p>
<p>Seriously, though, I had a career I quite liked when I met and fell in love with my wife.  I moved to be with her, and have not been able to find a stable job in the field since.  Do I regret my choice?  Not one little bit.</p>
<p>Now, our life hasn&#8217;t quite played out like in the movies, but I&#8217;ll likely end up a barrista or the equivalent next year, which will put my post graduate degrees to great use, I&#8217;m sure.  I suppose I could move to another state where I&#8217;m more likely to find work in my chosen field, but that would mean not being near my wife.</p>
<p>So in at least one case, life is actually sorta like the movie.  The difference being that in the movie, when the career person gives up their career as a lawyer or investment banker, they find a DIFFERENT fulfilling career as a teacher or a park ranger.  I gave UP a career as a teacher, and will probably end up with a McJob.  So I guess there is some difference there.</p>
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		<title>By: cat</title>
		<link>http://www.overthinkingit.com/2010/03/17/for-love-or-money-the-lessons-of-modern-romance/#comment-16028</link>
		<dc:creator>cat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 Mar 2010 02:48:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.overthinkingit.com/?p=13944#comment-16028</guid>
		<description>I have to love any argument that combines the concept of &quot;true love&quot; with a historical analysis of social class. Nevertheless...I feel the need to disagree on a couple of points. 

You have chosen, in my opinion, fairly awful examples of the true love/romcom genres. But leaving that aside, I will address those examples.

The Devil Wears Prada: I may be biased from having read the mediocre book but I think the struggle here is separate from love and career. It is about how much the main character is willing to do to achieve her ends. By returning to her boyfriend in the end (which does not happen in the book) she is still pursuing a career, and arguably more effectively (instead of hoping magazine editor lackey will launch her into her chosen career). 

Pyramus and Thisbe: They ignored their parents&#039; disapproval. 
Twelfth Night: Viola defies societal norms and risks dishonor. 
And given one of the possible origins of Twelfth Night, these stories are less about dropping everything for love and more about pursuing a relationship that is being blocked by society after it has already blossomed. 

I&#039;m wandering awkwardly to a point, which is...perhaps it isn&#039;t Career vs. True Love but more of a Societal Perception vs. True Love. 

&quot;First, it’s a false dichotomy. Someone who truly loves you should be able to accept the job you work in.&quot;
-I think often it&#039;s less about the person you love being able to accept the job you work in and the strain of being able to sustain the level of success in work and a healthy relationship simultaneously. These characters usually are businesspeople, architects...not tea cozy knitters. They opt for jobs that are less taxing but don&#039;t necessary mean they fall into financial hardship or aren&#039;t pursuing careers they enjoy. These significant others are similar to the &quot;manic pixie dreamgirls&quot; who change the protagonist&#039;s life for the better. 

Hate to say it, but as for the divorce statistics, not everyone who gets married is in love. Minor point. 

Shakespeare in Love: It seems to be much more about conforming to society&#039;s norms, expectations, and notions of honor than choosing career over love. One could also see her as making a sacrifice for his career...but then wouldn&#039;t that mean choosing love because she chose unhappiness to protect him and allow him to pursue his career? 

Thank you for reading all of my rambling.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have to love any argument that combines the concept of &#8220;true love&#8221; with a historical analysis of social class. Nevertheless&#8230;I feel the need to disagree on a couple of points. </p>
<p>You have chosen, in my opinion, fairly awful examples of the true love/romcom genres. But leaving that aside, I will address those examples.</p>
<p>The Devil Wears Prada: I may be biased from having read the mediocre book but I think the struggle here is separate from love and career. It is about how much the main character is willing to do to achieve her ends. By returning to her boyfriend in the end (which does not happen in the book) she is still pursuing a career, and arguably more effectively (instead of hoping magazine editor lackey will launch her into her chosen career). </p>
<p>Pyramus and Thisbe: They ignored their parents&#8217; disapproval.<br />
Twelfth Night: Viola defies societal norms and risks dishonor.<br />
And given one of the possible origins of Twelfth Night, these stories are less about dropping everything for love and more about pursuing a relationship that is being blocked by society after it has already blossomed. </p>
<p>I&#8217;m wandering awkwardly to a point, which is&#8230;perhaps it isn&#8217;t Career vs. True Love but more of a Societal Perception vs. True Love. </p>
<p>&#8220;First, it’s a false dichotomy. Someone who truly loves you should be able to accept the job you work in.&#8221;<br />
-I think often it&#8217;s less about the person you love being able to accept the job you work in and the strain of being able to sustain the level of success in work and a healthy relationship simultaneously. These characters usually are businesspeople, architects&#8230;not tea cozy knitters. They opt for jobs that are less taxing but don&#8217;t necessary mean they fall into financial hardship or aren&#8217;t pursuing careers they enjoy. These significant others are similar to the &#8220;manic pixie dreamgirls&#8221; who change the protagonist&#8217;s life for the better. </p>
<p>Hate to say it, but as for the divorce statistics, not everyone who gets married is in love. Minor point. </p>
<p>Shakespeare in Love: It seems to be much more about conforming to society&#8217;s norms, expectations, and notions of honor than choosing career over love. One could also see her as making a sacrifice for his career&#8230;but then wouldn&#8217;t that mean choosing love because she chose unhappiness to protect him and allow him to pursue his career? </p>
<p>Thank you for reading all of my rambling.</p>
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		<title>By: Darin</title>
		<link>http://www.overthinkingit.com/2010/03/17/for-love-or-money-the-lessons-of-modern-romance/#comment-16026</link>
		<dc:creator>Darin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 Mar 2010 02:21:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.overthinkingit.com/?p=13944#comment-16026</guid>
		<description>(I&#039;ve come down off my rant even though I still think it&#039;s valid.)

The reason that the Love vs. Career persists, unfortunately, is not worth overthinking.  It&#039;s easy, Hollywood-style. It&#039;s a formula that we can obviously see that makes money as we have shown.  The career is the antagonist that everyone can relate to, easy to hate.  There is a boss that plays to type that everyone can relate to.  We connect quickly with the protagonist, trying to make a living and usually raise a child as a man, or trying to maintain my esteem/independence/success as a woman.  The protagonist is offer a conflict that we can all root for and all know they&#039;ll succeed at. Easy fight, easy winner, easy warm fuzzies.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>(I&#8217;ve come down off my rant even though I still think it&#8217;s valid.)</p>
<p>The reason that the Love vs. Career persists, unfortunately, is not worth overthinking.  It&#8217;s easy, Hollywood-style. It&#8217;s a formula that we can obviously see that makes money as we have shown.  The career is the antagonist that everyone can relate to, easy to hate.  There is a boss that plays to type that everyone can relate to.  We connect quickly with the protagonist, trying to make a living and usually raise a child as a man, or trying to maintain my esteem/independence/success as a woman.  The protagonist is offer a conflict that we can all root for and all know they&#8217;ll succeed at. Easy fight, easy winner, easy warm fuzzies.</p>
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		<title>By: perich</title>
		<link>http://www.overthinkingit.com/2010/03/17/for-love-or-money-the-lessons-of-modern-romance/#comment-16017</link>
		<dc:creator>perich</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 17 Mar 2010 20:32:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.overthinkingit.com/?p=13944#comment-16017</guid>
		<description>@Ed: &quot;You still see this with some careers in pre-industrial professions, for example the concept of the “army wife” who essentially marries the institution when she marries the soldier, or “vicar’s wife” (leaving aside the situation with priests who can’t marry at all) is very real.&quot;

That&#039;s pretty compelling!  Good stuff.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Ed: &#8220;You still see this with some careers in pre-industrial professions, for example the concept of the “army wife” who essentially marries the institution when she marries the soldier, or “vicar’s wife” (leaving aside the situation with priests who can’t marry at all) is very real.&#8221;</p>
<p>That&#8217;s pretty compelling!  Good stuff.</p>
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