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	<title>Comments on: [Think Tank] Is Avatar This Generation&#8217;s Star Wars?</title>
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	<description>Overthinking It subjects the popular culture to a level of scrutiny it probably doesn&#039;t deserve.</description>
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		<title>By: perich</title>
		<link>http://www.overthinkingit.com/2009/12/18/think-tank-avatar-star-wars/#comment-14078</link>
		<dc:creator>perich</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Dec 2009 14:08:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.overthinkingit.com/?p=12130#comment-14078</guid>
		<description>@TheGryphon: would you care to elaborate?  The Japanese and Campbell-ian roots of Lucas&#039; work is well known, but I&#039;ve never heard this angle before.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@TheGryphon: would you care to elaborate?  The Japanese and Campbell-ian roots of Lucas&#8217; work is well known, but I&#8217;ve never heard this angle before.</p>
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		<title>By: TheGryphon</title>
		<link>http://www.overthinkingit.com/2009/12/18/think-tank-avatar-star-wars/#comment-14076</link>
		<dc:creator>TheGryphon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Dec 2009 13:36:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.overthinkingit.com/?p=12130#comment-14076</guid>
		<description>OK all I&#039;m saying is do some research guys ... Luke is Lugh of the Long Arm ... Vader is Balor of the Evil Eye ... the whole root of the story (whether Lucas knew it or not) is ripped from Celtic mythology.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>OK all I&#8217;m saying is do some research guys &#8230; Luke is Lugh of the Long Arm &#8230; Vader is Balor of the Evil Eye &#8230; the whole root of the story (whether Lucas knew it or not) is ripped from Celtic mythology.</p>
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		<title>By: Sami</title>
		<link>http://www.overthinkingit.com/2009/12/18/think-tank-avatar-star-wars/#comment-14071</link>
		<dc:creator>Sami</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Dec 2009 08:25:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.overthinkingit.com/?p=12130#comment-14071</guid>
		<description>Tell you what guys. The fact that you may even try to argue if it&#039;s a match or not to Star Wars speaks volumes about the work Cameron has put before us. 

Fact about this is this is a ground breaking technologies we are seeing before us and once again Cameron has raised the bar!

Yes sure the story may not be so original but guys what an original way to say an old story! 

Guys think about it you are presented with a whole alien world that looks real and not cartoonish and your feel that you can almost touch it! After this the next step up would be to actually feel whats going on!

All I can say I have gone and watched the movie. I did not feel bored. It felt like i was on an alien world, sure the story could have been made different better whatever but it was not bad the way it was. So thank you Cameron keep them coming!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tell you what guys. The fact that you may even try to argue if it&#8217;s a match or not to Star Wars speaks volumes about the work Cameron has put before us. </p>
<p>Fact about this is this is a ground breaking technologies we are seeing before us and once again Cameron has raised the bar!</p>
<p>Yes sure the story may not be so original but guys what an original way to say an old story! </p>
<p>Guys think about it you are presented with a whole alien world that looks real and not cartoonish and your feel that you can almost touch it! After this the next step up would be to actually feel whats going on!</p>
<p>All I can say I have gone and watched the movie. I did not feel bored. It felt like i was on an alien world, sure the story could have been made different better whatever but it was not bad the way it was. So thank you Cameron keep them coming!</p>
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		<title>By: Nate</title>
		<link>http://www.overthinkingit.com/2009/12/18/think-tank-avatar-star-wars/#comment-14070</link>
		<dc:creator>Nate</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Dec 2009 06:05:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.overthinkingit.com/?p=12130#comment-14070</guid>
		<description>Avatar did showcase a great and bright new world.  Although the story was intriguing I don&#039;t believe that it will ever match the timelessness that Star Wars has.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Avatar did showcase a great and bright new world.  Although the story was intriguing I don&#8217;t believe that it will ever match the timelessness that Star Wars has.</p>
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		<title>By: Tom P</title>
		<link>http://www.overthinkingit.com/2009/12/18/think-tank-avatar-star-wars/#comment-14069</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom P</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Dec 2009 06:03:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.overthinkingit.com/?p=12130#comment-14069</guid>
		<description>@potato: &lt;i&gt;How do you know how long it’s taken the Millenium Falcon to get to Alderaan? Or how long Luke has been on Dagobah? It sounds you’re making assumptions on which you have no basis.&lt;/i&gt;

I&#039;m making assumptions based on what&#039;s going on at the same time.  Luke heads to Degobah at about the same time that Han and Leia go to Bespin from Hoth.  The Falcon&#039;s hyperdrive engines are out of order, so we have to assume that Bespin and Hoth are relatively close... like... in the same star system or else they&#039;d be traveling for years.  So, best-case scenario is Luke, in the X-Wing with a working hyperdrive, gets to Degobah instantly (and can return to Bespin in about the same elapsed time) and the Falcon travels for months (unless you want to argue that years pass between the time the Falcon leaves Hoth and arrives on Bespin -- in which case I argue there is no way that Han &amp; Leia hadn&#039;t either killed each other or started a family), Luke is still learning enough about Jedi-ing to challenge Darth Vader to a knock-down/drag-out in a couple months.

I&#039;m pretty sure in the Star Trek movie universe it&#039;s well-established that a good hyperdrive allows a ship to cross the galaxy in &quot;a few days&quot;.  The Falcon, clearly, had a pretty crappy hyperdrive, but I&#039;d still argue that it doesn&#039;t take them more than a couple weeks to get from Tatooine to what&#039;s left of Alderaan.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@potato: <i>How do you know how long it’s taken the Millenium Falcon to get to Alderaan? Or how long Luke has been on Dagobah? It sounds you’re making assumptions on which you have no basis.</i></p>
<p>I&#8217;m making assumptions based on what&#8217;s going on at the same time.  Luke heads to Degobah at about the same time that Han and Leia go to Bespin from Hoth.  The Falcon&#8217;s hyperdrive engines are out of order, so we have to assume that Bespin and Hoth are relatively close&#8230; like&#8230; in the same star system or else they&#8217;d be traveling for years.  So, best-case scenario is Luke, in the X-Wing with a working hyperdrive, gets to Degobah instantly (and can return to Bespin in about the same elapsed time) and the Falcon travels for months (unless you want to argue that years pass between the time the Falcon leaves Hoth and arrives on Bespin &#8212; in which case I argue there is no way that Han &amp; Leia hadn&#8217;t either killed each other or started a family), Luke is still learning enough about Jedi-ing to challenge Darth Vader to a knock-down/drag-out in a couple months.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m pretty sure in the Star Trek movie universe it&#8217;s well-established that a good hyperdrive allows a ship to cross the galaxy in &#8220;a few days&#8221;.  The Falcon, clearly, had a pretty crappy hyperdrive, but I&#8217;d still argue that it doesn&#8217;t take them more than a couple weeks to get from Tatooine to what&#8217;s left of Alderaan.</p>
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		<title>By: Srinivas</title>
		<link>http://www.overthinkingit.com/2009/12/18/think-tank-avatar-star-wars/#comment-14067</link>
		<dc:creator>Srinivas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Dec 2009 04:54:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.overthinkingit.com/?p=12130#comment-14067</guid>
		<description>i&#039;d say in terms of depicting a whole new world, both Star Wars and Avatar are full of realistic imagination
As far as story is concerned, Star Wars scores a lot more than Avatar
I cannot express as much as the guys above me, there are a lot of similarities between Star Wars and Avatar
Though Avatar stands apart in a few scenes of its own - Pandora&#039;s description, the first flight by (avatar) Jake Sully, Eywa, among other things.
As far as CGI, both the epics stand apart in their own time, simply GR8
i just hope to see more of Avatar</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>i&#8217;d say in terms of depicting a whole new world, both Star Wars and Avatar are full of realistic imagination<br />
As far as story is concerned, Star Wars scores a lot more than Avatar<br />
I cannot express as much as the guys above me, there are a lot of similarities between Star Wars and Avatar<br />
Though Avatar stands apart in a few scenes of its own &#8211; Pandora&#8217;s description, the first flight by (avatar) Jake Sully, Eywa, among other things.<br />
As far as CGI, both the epics stand apart in their own time, simply GR8<br />
i just hope to see more of Avatar</p>
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		<title>By: Francisco Bacon</title>
		<link>http://www.overthinkingit.com/2009/12/18/think-tank-avatar-star-wars/#comment-14065</link>
		<dc:creator>Francisco Bacon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Dec 2009 03:20:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.overthinkingit.com/?p=12130#comment-14065</guid>
		<description>first of all, i find it interesting that all mainstream outlets and critics are raving about this Avatar thing.  i noticed some negative user reviews posted under Manohla Dargis&#039; NYTimes review, and by end of day they had been removed !  Makes one wonder if all major media companies were underwriters of the film&#039;s $500 million price tag, and are now actively propagandizing to ensure a return on investment. 

We can all agree (even Avatar fans, it seems) that the story was rather thin.  We also agree that Cameron seems to have cribbed from just about everywhere.  Most people cite other major sci-fi works like Dune as his obvious inspiration, but I felt the film borrowed rather heavily from the works of Hayao Miyazaki (which I find ironic, since Miyazaki&#039;s cel animated worlds are decidedly more &quot;2D&quot; in visuals, but whose characters have tremendously more depth.)

I am very surprised to see serious film critics gobbling up the technology here, and failing to really add any serious demerits for the weak storytelling.  I would have expected a harsher critical reaction.  It seems like when a film has such a massive budget, critics love to swarm over every surface of the film, examining faults.  

Rather than detail every one of the film&#039;s storytelling flaws, I will instead state simply that the 3D technology that was so hyped, and which got me to see a film whose story, from the marketing, looked rather uninteresting to me, came off as more of a distraction than an enhancement.  Creating more &quot;depth&quot; to the image, encouraged my novice eyes to explore every object in the frame, even when that object was an out-of-focus foreground element instead of the characters (or any other compositional &quot;focus&quot;).

While Dargis and other reviewers may foam at the mouth over the possibility of 3D being &quot;the future of movies,&quot; it&#039;s my sincerest hope that it quickly disappears.  I remember a quote I heard attributed to Leni Riefenstahl to the effect that &quot;[the coming of sound spelled the death of cinema.]&quot;  Which in truth, it did.  The cinema of 18fps silver nitrate with intertitles was forever replaced with sound, color, THX, CGI and 3D.  I still think Lang&#039;s Metropolis is better sci-fi than Avatar.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>first of all, i find it interesting that all mainstream outlets and critics are raving about this Avatar thing.  i noticed some negative user reviews posted under Manohla Dargis&#8217; NYTimes review, and by end of day they had been removed !  Makes one wonder if all major media companies were underwriters of the film&#8217;s $500 million price tag, and are now actively propagandizing to ensure a return on investment. </p>
<p>We can all agree (even Avatar fans, it seems) that the story was rather thin.  We also agree that Cameron seems to have cribbed from just about everywhere.  Most people cite other major sci-fi works like Dune as his obvious inspiration, but I felt the film borrowed rather heavily from the works of Hayao Miyazaki (which I find ironic, since Miyazaki&#8217;s cel animated worlds are decidedly more &#8220;2D&#8221; in visuals, but whose characters have tremendously more depth.)</p>
<p>I am very surprised to see serious film critics gobbling up the technology here, and failing to really add any serious demerits for the weak storytelling.  I would have expected a harsher critical reaction.  It seems like when a film has such a massive budget, critics love to swarm over every surface of the film, examining faults.  </p>
<p>Rather than detail every one of the film&#8217;s storytelling flaws, I will instead state simply that the 3D technology that was so hyped, and which got me to see a film whose story, from the marketing, looked rather uninteresting to me, came off as more of a distraction than an enhancement.  Creating more &#8220;depth&#8221; to the image, encouraged my novice eyes to explore every object in the frame, even when that object was an out-of-focus foreground element instead of the characters (or any other compositional &#8220;focus&#8221;).</p>
<p>While Dargis and other reviewers may foam at the mouth over the possibility of 3D being &#8220;the future of movies,&#8221; it&#8217;s my sincerest hope that it quickly disappears.  I remember a quote I heard attributed to Leni Riefenstahl to the effect that &#8220;[the coming of sound spelled the death of cinema.]&#8221;  Which in truth, it did.  The cinema of 18fps silver nitrate with intertitles was forever replaced with sound, color, THX, CGI and 3D.  I still think Lang&#8217;s Metropolis is better sci-fi than Avatar.</p>
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		<title>By: MJG</title>
		<link>http://www.overthinkingit.com/2009/12/18/think-tank-avatar-star-wars/#comment-14064</link>
		<dc:creator>MJG</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Dec 2009 03:11:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.overthinkingit.com/?p=12130#comment-14064</guid>
		<description>Die Hard&#039;s dialogue is not particularly good and doesn&#039;t compare well with Star Wars. There are a few good lines here and there, and it benefits immensely from Alan Rickman, but some of the scenes in Die Hard are flat-out terrible. The &quot;friend&quot; scene where the guy goes into Rickman&#039;s office and gets shot? All of the dialogue between Willis and the cop from Family Matters? The FBI idiots? Awful.

Also, with regard to Saving Private Ryan, was there any memorable dialogue in it? The whole movie is a cheese fest, although apart from the bracketing segments, an extremely well-structured movie.

Don&#039;t get me wrong - I enjoy Die Hard and the damn thing is on roller skates when the crappy supporting characters aren&#039;t talking. Saving Private Ryan has a core hour and 45 minutes that is terrific and a lot of dumb stuff at the beginning and the end. Avatar, it seems to me, will have roughly the same impact as Gladiator and SPR, although the eco-theme will turn off some of the normal macho audience. It doesn&#039;t make anyone forget Aliens...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Die Hard&#8217;s dialogue is not particularly good and doesn&#8217;t compare well with Star Wars. There are a few good lines here and there, and it benefits immensely from Alan Rickman, but some of the scenes in Die Hard are flat-out terrible. The &#8220;friend&#8221; scene where the guy goes into Rickman&#8217;s office and gets shot? All of the dialogue between Willis and the cop from Family Matters? The FBI idiots? Awful.</p>
<p>Also, with regard to Saving Private Ryan, was there any memorable dialogue in it? The whole movie is a cheese fest, although apart from the bracketing segments, an extremely well-structured movie.</p>
<p>Don&#8217;t get me wrong &#8211; I enjoy Die Hard and the damn thing is on roller skates when the crappy supporting characters aren&#8217;t talking. Saving Private Ryan has a core hour and 45 minutes that is terrific and a lot of dumb stuff at the beginning and the end. Avatar, it seems to me, will have roughly the same impact as Gladiator and SPR, although the eco-theme will turn off some of the normal macho audience. It doesn&#8217;t make anyone forget Aliens&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: saint</title>
		<link>http://www.overthinkingit.com/2009/12/18/think-tank-avatar-star-wars/#comment-14062</link>
		<dc:creator>saint</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Dec 2009 02:00:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.overthinkingit.com/?p=12130#comment-14062</guid>
		<description>I love A Man for All Seasons, don&#039;t get me wrong. The scene where More says goodbye to his family in his prison cell makes me cry every time. What I mean by &quot;burden of language&quot; is that King Lear starts out with a bunch of characters that Shakespeare had to create out of nothing, so language has a lot of jobs: it has to establish character, it has to be entertaining, it has to be beautiful and THEN it has to tell a story. Which it does, beautifully, because Shakespeare was brilliant.

A Man for All Seasons and Richard III have the advantage of beginning with a relationship to history, so there&#039;s at least the possibility of the audience having certain character and story information already. Richard, for example, lives in England. When he fights the French, we know what that means without spending a scene describing how awful the French are. When King Henry shows up in A Man for All Seasons, that scene is so much more exciting and shocking because we know what it means for Henry to show up anywhere. Yes, he&#039;s set up well in the dialog and in the story before he shows up, but fans of history get a lot more out of his character because of the cult that has grown up around Henry in the real world.

When Boba Fett shows up in Attack of the Clones, we don&#039;t need to see a scene explaining how he grows up to be a bad-ass bounty hunter because we have that information. Those scenes can advance with that advantage, and they can focus on the story because the characters are already interesting. Unfortunately, that doesn&#039;t happen often in the series.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I love A Man for All Seasons, don&#8217;t get me wrong. The scene where More says goodbye to his family in his prison cell makes me cry every time. What I mean by &#8220;burden of language&#8221; is that King Lear starts out with a bunch of characters that Shakespeare had to create out of nothing, so language has a lot of jobs: it has to establish character, it has to be entertaining, it has to be beautiful and THEN it has to tell a story. Which it does, beautifully, because Shakespeare was brilliant.</p>
<p>A Man for All Seasons and Richard III have the advantage of beginning with a relationship to history, so there&#8217;s at least the possibility of the audience having certain character and story information already. Richard, for example, lives in England. When he fights the French, we know what that means without spending a scene describing how awful the French are. When King Henry shows up in A Man for All Seasons, that scene is so much more exciting and shocking because we know what it means for Henry to show up anywhere. Yes, he&#8217;s set up well in the dialog and in the story before he shows up, but fans of history get a lot more out of his character because of the cult that has grown up around Henry in the real world.</p>
<p>When Boba Fett shows up in Attack of the Clones, we don&#8217;t need to see a scene explaining how he grows up to be a bad-ass bounty hunter because we have that information. Those scenes can advance with that advantage, and they can focus on the story because the characters are already interesting. Unfortunately, that doesn&#8217;t happen often in the series.</p>
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		<title>By: Dokk</title>
		<link>http://www.overthinkingit.com/2009/12/18/think-tank-avatar-star-wars/#comment-14059</link>
		<dc:creator>Dokk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Dec 2009 00:04:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.overthinkingit.com/?p=12130#comment-14059</guid>
		<description>Doubt it. How many &quot;this generation&#039;s Star Wars&quot; are we gonna have anyways?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Doubt it. How many &#8220;this generation&#8217;s Star Wars&#8221; are we gonna have anyways?</p>
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